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Being from Brazil and a huge Sabbath fan I did some time ago estimates of their sales here, and generally they were 20-30% higher than the numbers shown here. These sales seem to be compatible with vinyl only sales mostly (for 70s and 80s albums). For instance, as the analysis done here show Born Again probably sold very well upon release, something close to 95K upon release. It happens that in 1999 all the Sabbath catalogue from the debut to Eternal Idol was re-released in Brazil, and they sold VERY WELL, they were cheap and were sold in most supermarket chains, in some cases I'd say they sold around 50 thousand copies in the case of the first 4 Sabbath albums. My estimate for Born Again would be something around 30 thousand copies, plus more recent releases would put Born Again sales around 130 thousand copies.
In the case of 13 I catalogued as many bar codes as I could and the sales are for sure at least 80 thousand (it was released in two versions simple and double upon release each one was produced in a 20000 bach each with barcode AA, these barcodes go up AL at least with some large batches of 5 thousand copies). In the case of Dehumanizer my estimates were 120 thousand and for Vol.4 300 thousand.
Hi Breno!
All sales, from LPs to CDs, were considered. Numbers displayed here are already absolute great results for Brazil, the band was heavily popular there. I feel you are overestimating recurrent sales though. For 13, its AA codes weren't 20k x 2, but 10k for the Standard release and 20k for the digital. Also, codes can reach or exceed 5k when an album is being very strong, but after the initial impact numbers are always fairly lower. Here are 13 known codes btw:
13 Standard CD AA 10000
13 Standard CD AB 500
13 Standard CD AE 1000
13 Standard CD AI 5000
13 Standard CD AJ 5000
13 Standard CD AK 1500
13 Digipack CD AA 20000
13 Digipack CD AB 5000
13 Digipack CD AC 5000
13 Digipack CD AE 1500
Please consider that codes which are find online are usually the biggest ones. Obviously, you have 10 times more chances of seeing a 5000 units code than a 500 units code. They add for 54.5k units, with 6 missing ones, likely in the 500-1500 ballpark, hence the 65k adding in a few downloads too (low in Brazil and for BS).
Below are owners of Paranoid CD versions on Discogs:
115 Pre-1999 CD releases (inc. releases which sold in 2003-2005 too)
115 1999 CD releases
108 post-2003 standard releases
121 post-2003 digipack releases
Codes reflect at most 50,000 for all the releases selling since 2003 combined. They add for well over half of the total CD owners on Discogs, so we can't expect the 1999 version to be at 50,000 units on its own. I use the example of Paranoid because it's their biggest one, others are lower, around 30,000 since 2003.
Hi MJD
You are correct when it comes to the first pressing of the normal 13 cd .
Here are the codes that I found: Normal cd AA10000, AB500, AE1000, AI5000, AJ5000, AK1500 double cd: AA20000, AB5000, AC5000, AD1000, AI5000, AJ5000, AK1500. They add up to 63 K, if you assume that all remaining pressings are 500 you'd arrive in a minimum of 75K.
I'm taking as a basis of comparison releases with known sales, in the same genre, for instance Kiss Creatures of the Night with 120K, and for cds for instance Iron Maiden Brave New World with a minimum of 100K in the first year (they were awarded a gold disc for 100k in january 2001). If that is true and Black Sabbath has the same "level of collectability" compared to those bands (which I believe is reasonable to assume), each of the have roughly 300 copies on discogs you would conclude that Born again sold around 120K.
For instance in the case of their most sucesful album Vol.4-566 copies on discogs (if they are in the same proportion as Kiss-Creatures of the Night with 120k copies and 357 copies on discogs) you'd conclude that it sold 190K on vinyl. It has 291 cds, I dont think newer pressings can be compared to old ones, but by taling into account only the 1999 pressing that I mention you'd conclude that it sold 45K. The 2005 release goes up to barcode AL at least (although it
s only 500 copies), so I think it's very reasonable to assume 15k for the 2005 release (98 copies on discogs VS 306 Iron Maiden Brave New World). So if my assumptions are correct one would arrive at a minimum estimate of 250 K (my actual estimate was around 290).
I did the same for others and concluded that a very safe estimate of 20-30% more than the numbers shown here.
Don`t get me wrong I not complaining about the numbers, which I think are crazy, to think that they sold of the order 40% or half of what the major artists like Queen and Michael Jackson is a lot. And also I'm a big fan of the website, each time I come here I get into a black hole at go to sleep at 5am!
Cheers!
Let's take the case of Paranoid, I estimated 105K on vinyl (using Kiss-Creatures of the Night, 120K sold with 357 copies on discogs), 38K for the 1999 cd (taking Iron Maiden Brave New World as a basis of comparison, released one year after with similar audience, 100K for 306 copies on discogs, although it is probably a bit more than 100K), 5K for the 1994 cd, 183cds registered for 2003-2007 releases would probably add up to more than 50K (barcode goes up to AV2000 at least so I think 50K is not a bad estimate), plus say 3K for 2015 releases. So I'd say 200K for Paranoid.
Mob Rules is easy because there are few releases: 81K on vinyl, plus 31K on the Abril 1999-2001 cds, plus 2-3K for 2015 cds. Around 115K.
Correction: the 13 barcodes that I know add up to 65.5K plus 9 unknown codes assumed to be 500 will lead to an 70 K estimate, which is within a 10% difference from your estimate.
Obviously the author of the article never listened to Black Sabbath. They never praised satan, you ignorant tool.
Yes, it includes all the countries.
Figures were not accurate enough in Argentina to clearly explicite them, but this country is included too.
Any chance to do similar analysis of UFO albums? Thanks for this - very interesting reading.👍
What is the name/title 'orphan' supposed to be? It's listed after 13. I searched this page for an explanation of what it is but found nothing. It's not a Sabbath release of any kind or bootleg. Also FYI 13 is Black Sabbath's last album. The EP 'The End' was released after 13 though. But it isn't an album. Also, the album 'The Devil You Know' is not Black Sabbath. It's Heaven & Hell's only album. Members: Dio, Iommi, Geezer, and Ward. Forming in 2006, Ward was replaced by Vinny Appice in 2006, and the band existed until Dio succumbed to stomach cancer in 2010.
*Remove whatever "Orphan" is and Heaven & Hell's "The Devil You Know" album.
The orphan section just relates to songs that they recorded, that didn't appear on any of their studio albums. I'm guessing that Heaven & Hells The Devil You Know is included, because it is basically just Black Sabbath going under a different name.
I reckon this will need to be updated when the numbers of the tony martin reissues come out, Anno Domini 1989 – 1995 and the digital streams. the set sold out quickly before release and the label were scrambling to get a 2nd pressing going.